Crogglement

[feuervogel]

Thanks to a conversation on twitter, I know I'm not the only person who feels this way; I'm just wondering how common it is.

I'm completely croggled that people casually assume or casually state that they'll be getting some sort of inheritance when their parents die. I've never assumed I'd get anything other than debt to pay off or possessions to sell off when my parents die. At least my mom's house is almost paid for; no idea about dad's. (And another comment on twitter reminds me that someone's got to pay for the funerals...)

To copy and paste someone's comment to a friend's post (completely without attribution and with some paraphrasing/editing), this is what sparked this line of thought:

There's also a sense of "it's spending down the inheritance either way; this way's just time-shifted". I trust my parents to have a good sense of their financial planning and what they intended to leave me, and if they happen to want to transfer some of that to me now rather than later, that's fine.

My mom doesn't buy me stuff. She stopped even sending me money at Christmas and my birthday a few years ago. She had to do two major home repairs last summer (ac/heat and water heater both died at the same time), and her tight budget got even tighter. I honestly don't know if she has a retirement savings plan, or if the United Methodist Church even offers one for their secretaries, or even if they did, if she'd have enough income to be able to split off a hundred bucks here or there to save up. (She's a blasted SECRETARY. For a CHURCH. If she makes more than 30k (or equivalent for the DC-Metro area), I'd be astonished.) The only thing I expect to receive from her is the treadle-powered Singer, which is what I told her I wanted when she asked when she made her will. If I'm still in this country, anyway. (It would be really cool if I could figure out how to get it to work, because it has feet useful for old-fashioned clothesmaking, like piping.)

Dad does buy me stuff sometimes, usually alcoholic beverages on the rare occasions we see each other. I have no idea what his financial situation is like. I assume not very good, because he's never been good at saving, and he's an owner-operator (that is, truck driver). I don't think you get 401(k)s with those jobs. He's got his truck and his house, which together could fetch probably half a million*, though I don't know what of that his girlfriend co-owns.

*Truck resale value depends on the age of the truck, mileage on the engine, and how fancy the sleeper area is. His has a huge bed (2 bunks, I think), a kitchenette, and a lav with shower.

Anyway, it just boggles my mind that people casually mention things like inheritance. Is it just me? Is it a product of my working class upbringing?

Comments

[quinfirefrorefiddle]

My parents are about equivalent to yours, and yeah, I don't expect much past having to sell their houses, which I doubt would go well. Though they do both have life insurance for the funerals. They save for end of life care, not me.

Here via the network

[devilc]

It's a middle class thing, and it's kind of a bad thing, because these days, I know people who assume that of course Mom/Dad/Auntie/Uncle etc. aren't going to blow through that money or won't have a problem that depletes all the resources, and they spend money accordingly. I think the assumption of inheritances comes from a time of a healthier economy and cheaper medical coverage. Also, more and more people are starting to outlive their savings due to better medical technology.

I've already come into a modest inheritance (property) when my mother passed suddenly, but when both grandparents died, I got (and expected) nothing more than some personal keepsakes. When my dad goes (which will happen sometime in the next 20 years), I expect nothing more than some personal keepsakes.

[miome]

I just wanted to mention, since you were talking about inheriting debt - not sure if you were serious or not - but that doesn't happen in the US. As I understand it, when someone dies all their cash and property are put together into an estate, and that estate is used to pay off their outstanding debt. If there's anything left, it's distributed according to their will, or if there's no will then according to state law. If there isn't enough in the estate to pay off their creditors, the creditors are SOL. It's illegal for them to go after the persons heirs or family. Some try anyway, because if someone agrees to take of the debt, they immediately become responsible for it. It's a nasty trick that unfortunately works too often, and is prosecuted not often enough.

[ranyart]

Hmmm. I do not know my parents' financial situation exactly. An inheritance has never been talked about, and that's fine - it's not something I really want to think about now and I don't think I deserve money from them or should assume anything about the situation. I'm very uncomfortable with the idea of planning around things that will happen when my parents die. But probably I would get some money from them? Or their house?

In terms of talking about it... my parents raised me to pretty much never talk about my financial situation with anyone or accept financial help, because both are Bad Manners and Not Done. Which makes the fact that they're now well off and sometimes give me money that I don't need weird and uncomfortable on a few levels. I remember when they worried about money more and my mom had her coupon stash and this clicker-thing that added up her purchases as she went around the grocery store (I used to bug her so much to let me play with it but I almost never got to hold it) so she wouldn't go over budget, and I guess that's where those lessons came from.

[lian]

I don't know, actually -- I'm firmly middle class (2nd gen) but I don't expect to inherit anything* apart from my share of the house (which my parents will be looking to sell while they still live, anyway, and then live off the sale.) My parents assured me their debts would be settled tho, so that's good.

*my mom has a gorgeous pair of earrings I asked her about, but that's it.

[gryphynshadow.livejournal.com]

I think it must be some kind of middle upper class wishful thinking. I bet that most folks don't know just how freaking expensive it is to die, or what the reality of the older generation's money situation is.

My uncle passed last month; he owed my aunt for a short term loan she made him early this year. My mom told my aunt not to cash the check he post dated for her, because she (my mom) needed to pay off as much of his bills as possible. {She told me yesterday that one day in the ER, right at the end of his life, cost $39,000.}

I've always known that the only inheritance I'll get from my parents is in the form of stuff. My great great grandmother's salt cellar, the peddle organ, some other random heirlooms and whatnot. Things that are not to be sold or traded away for anything at all ever. But a big lump o money? Yeah, no.

It was a big deal that my mom found paperwork among my uncles stuff for a life insurance policy he purchased in 1976. If he paid on it, it'll be worth $20,000, and go to her. It's like, whoa. That's a surprise. And every penny of that will go to paying my parents bills, like their mortgage and car payments.

So, I suspect that a lot of people are living in a happy dream world where their parents have a lot of money just there, to help them out and leave them in a big vault they'll be able to swim in like Scrooge McDuck. There's this idea that our parents are better at this whole adulthood thing than we are, and that they'll take care of us after they're gone even. To which I say: ha. I wish.

[stormsdotter.livejournal.com]

I have my grandma's pump treadle Singer. (I was the only one she taught to use it.)

Someday when I have a larger home I want to pull it out and remember how to use it.

[luckykitty.livejournal.com]

Well, I can't speak for others, but I know my parents planned from the outset to make sure they had enough to take care of themselves barring something really horrible happening, at least until they are 90, and have also sat us down and told us what they have tried to set aside for us and how we are to take care of things after they pass away. But, they started out from the time they were married being very careful, saving, and consider it pretty much their top priority to save for "the next generation." I don't know if it is cultural, or what, and I do know they both worked very hard, planned very smart, and were very lucky.

When I was growing up we lived very lower-middle-class to poor, but as we've gotten older my parents have begun to live more upper middle class. Is it because in the beginning they were saving so much, and now they feel more comfortable and spend more (though they are still stingy)? Or because they're one of the success stories of actually raising yourself financially upwards? I don't know.

I just wish I could manage to follow their footsteps, because I only half-heartedly follow their financial advice, and I know my finances have suffered for that.

[corpsefairy.livejournal.com]

It's a completely foreign idea to me, too. Even if I did talk to my mother (I don't really like her, so I don't bother. She still gives me inexplicable Christmas gifts through my sister, which annoys me, but I haven't figured out a way of getting her to stop without being rude to my sister.), I wouldn't expect inheritance because she's very poor. I assume she still has a job as a social worker, but last time I checked was like ten years ago.

I think one of my fathers (my mother's ex-husband) is better off, but not significantly. I hear from him occasionally via e-mail and holiday card. The other one (my biological father) I haven't talked to since I was 13, so I have absolutely no idea what his situation is.

Anyway, my weird details are irrelevant. The point is: yes, I'm poor too, my family is poor, and the idea of inheritance is a thing that happens to other people.

[faithful-summer.livejournal.com]

Not directly related to your topic, but I am amazed that there's room for all that stuff in a truck. I never had any idea that rigs could even have half of those things.

[tiurin.livejournal.com]

Since my dad was a government worker who started back in the days when they had excellent pension/insurance packages, and we moved into a house a little further out and which wasn't huge (it was plenty big in that my sister and I both had our own bedrooms, and there was a small guest room, but hardly the McMansion common in suburbia these days) so they'll have it paid off in another couple years, I do think it highly likely that there will be some money to inherit. It won't be huge, but I think they said that if either of us start a family, they expect to be able to leave us enough to pay for a couple years of in-state college expenses for a few grandkids.

A lot of this was because we basically didn't have vacations when I was a kid (just visits to the grandparents in NYC, which didn't cost much more than gas), since they were determined to save enough $ to send us to college without debt. As it turns out, they didn't need to spend anything at all for my college, so that's been sitting in the bank ever since. I've taken a look at some of their retirement planning numbers, and they appear all set. Basically, we went from about 60th percentile in my youth and HS years(not adjusted for living near DC), to about 80th percentile when I was in college due to Dad's promotion, but non-college spending didn't increase.

I don't expect anything from them, and unlike my sister, I haven't even placed dibs on anything like the old living room sofa which is extremely comfortable to nap on. But given that neither wants prolonged, painful medical treatment if they come down w/cancer or something, I do think it's highly probable that I'll end up inheriting at least $50-75k.

[steuard.livejournal.com]

I'm not clear on what's actively bothering (or just confusing?) you about the conversation you've described (which I'll readily admit may be due to all kinds of privilege of my own, and also to not actually being part of that discussion). Are you saying that people who expect to inherit money should avoid discussing it out of politeness to those who aren't so fortunate? Or are you simply surprised that people who've grown up in those fortunate families are aware of the planning that the elder generation(s) are doing?

If the concern is politeness, I can see your point, and I think wealthy(-ier) people in general need to be careful about casually commenting on their circumstances. But if you're surprised that the idea would come to mind at all, don't be: my impression is that most families that (successfully) plan to leave a significant inheritance to the next generation make a point of talking with their kids about how to do it. In part that's because the kids may be active participants in the plan (they might start getting money before their parents or grandparents die, for instance). But also, families with a tradition of passing on money often see "looking out for future generations" as one of their family's important values, so they make an effort to ensure that their kids can and will do the same.

I won't talk too much about my own family here, since (as noted above!) it seems a bit inappropriate. But as far back as my great-grandfather (at least), my mother's family has put a lot of effort into saving money to pass on to the kids. That began when he was an immigrant shopkeeper, and the upshot is that I expect to inherit some of that "family money" down the line. (It's been made pretty clear, too, that they expect me to do the same for my kids when the time comes: you're not supposed to spend "family money" on yourself, at least not permanently.)

Oh, and relevant to some other comments: quite often, much of one's "inheritance" comes from selling a house that's (mostly?) paid off. That may not be what the original conversation was about, but I think it's pretty common for a paid-off house to cover end-of-life medical expenses and then some.